The Vatican announced a bold move to steal disgruntled sheep from the Anglican fold. The alleged motive is “to make it easier for Anglicans to convert, reaching out to those who are disaffected by the election of female and gay bishops to join the Catholic Church’s conservative ranks.”
Sheep stealing is one of the oldest practices in the religious playbook, second only to multiplying by dividing, i.e., breaking away and forming new sects. I recall a time several years ago when a local pastor, aware of some difficulties that were going on in the church my family and I attended, unabashedly invited us (several times) to escape from it all by joining his church. We were not impressed.
I understand why church leaders find the temptation to steal sheep overpowering. Luring people away from another church into one’s own is a lot easier than actually winning new religious converts. Swiping sheep is a quick and easy way to get more butts in the pews and more coins in the coffers. Not that I’m suggesting that the Vatican’s interests may be so mundane. No – I’m sure the Church’s concern is entirely as advertised. Well, I suspect it’s at least partially as stated. After all, if people become disaffected with their churches, they may end up doing something really extreme, like giving up religion altogether. Wouldn’t that be dreadful?
– the chaplain
atimetorend
October 20, 2009 at 12:55 pm
But it isn’t seen as stealing the sheep from another part of the visible body of Christ the church, it is snatching those slated for destruction from the clutches of Satan, into a denomination of True Believers.
Postman
October 20, 2009 at 1:25 pm
Didn’t Judge Roy Bean used to hang people for sheep rustling? Where’s he when we need him?
On an off-topic note, I received both of the books on the right of this page today from B & N. Quite looking forward to both.
athinkingman
October 20, 2009 at 2:13 pm
And ironically, if anyone else was caught stealing, they would condemn the act (and probably the person too) as immoral. Talk about blind spot, and the blind leading the blind …
Lorena
October 20, 2009 at 5:20 pm
Wow! Given how tiny the world population of Anglicans worldwide is compared to Catholics, the RC church is sounding truly desperate.
Maybe Gawd should send the Pope a postcard to calm him down
Spanish Inquisitor
October 20, 2009 at 5:25 pm
I remember when my mother was in the hospital on her deathbed, the Catholic priest pulled me into the corridor to try to get me to “come back to the church.”
Though I guess that wasn’t sheep rustling as much as an attempt to turn a wolf into a sheep.
cl
October 20, 2009 at 5:39 pm
Interesting post chap.
Also, it’s a perfect way to leave the core issues unresolved, which only confirms the observation that large subsets of believers can’t get their marbles together. In a sense, I can’t help but see an analog for (a)theist debate, in that when issues aren’t exactly conducive to swift resolution, many on both sides are often willing to jump ship – essentially similar to the “spitting off and forming a new church” – which really just represents distancing ourselves from those we disagree with as opposed to attempting to reach any sort of intellectual common ground.
the chaplain
October 20, 2009 at 7:22 pm
atimetorend:
Sad to say, some churches really do believe that luring believers from other churches into their own is “snatching them from the clutches of Satan….”
Postie:
I finished reading Everything You Know About God is Wrong a couple of days ago. IMO, it’s not as strong an anthology as The Portable Atheist, in which Hitchens set the bar very high for this sort of collection. Several of the chapters are outstanding, many are worthwhile, and some are iffy. Let me know what you think when you’ve read it.
AThinkingMan:
Has anyone discovered a gene for the “My actions are not immoral, but yours are, even though we’re doing the same thing” trait?
Lorena:
Yeah, the Anglican communion is not nearly as large as the RC Church. It is pretty weird if the RCs are that desperate. How sad (she types with a smirk).
SI:
Maybe the priest mistook you for a black sheep rather than a wolf.
cl:
I agree that there is lots of room for common ground between people of different religious/philosophical views. I’m all for finding that ground and working together toward ends that we share in common. On the other hand, there are points at which meetings of such diverse minds will be impossible. Sometimes, people just have to accept those differences and be content to move in different directions. I don’t mind religious believers moving in their directions, as long as they don’t insist that I must move along with them.
athinkingman
October 21, 2009 at 3:41 am
I have just seen Lawrence Mills’s take on this story on Twitter, and found it amusing:
“@LawrenceMills Bold new ad campaign: “Tired of women and gays? Why not try… Catholicism.” http://bit.ly/41fV8l“
Eshu
October 21, 2009 at 9:26 am
Who’d have thought that this kind of twisted maths/logic would be a feature of religion? ;-P
Nightcap
October 21, 2009 at 11:44 am
Yes, it’s sheep-stealing, but Rome and Canterbury have been poaching each others’ flocks since Henry VIII first nationalized the monasteries. Baloney, bologna, it’s all the same thing. Just think of it as cigarette advertising: http://bill-sheehan.livejournal.com/65664.html
the chaplain
October 21, 2009 at 10:34 pm
athinkingman and Nightcap:
Thanks for the links – good stuff on both of them.
Eshu:
Math was never my strong suit either.
Cephus
October 22, 2009 at 11:30 am
I guess the Catholic Church needs to get some new altarboys to molest. Get ‘em while the gettings good.
cl
October 22, 2009 at 2:05 pm
Gee, what an intelligent, rational, (not to mention original) statement! I’m so impressed by the “commitment” to reason you brag about at your “bitch spot!”
ildi
October 22, 2009 at 3:46 pm
It definitely highlights the hypocrisy of the HMC’s position on priesthood celibacy. Eastern Catholic churches already have married priests, and currently any Anglican priest who is married and wants to convert to Catholicism can do so and still keep his wife.
God told the pope it was ok?
PhillyChief
October 22, 2009 at 11:52 pm
Well it’s a lot easier when they’re already broken in, right? I mean, most of the hard work is already done so it must be tempting for any church to steal sheep. It’s even easier than their usual thing of hunting for the weak.
Sarge
October 23, 2009 at 8:14 am
Aaaaah, sheep…
The flock never gets wise to the fact that the shepherd is only looking after their welfare for his own ultimate gain and good.
Postman
October 23, 2009 at 2:13 pm
Chappy,
I started reading “Greatest Show…” yesterday, because it’s a more convenient size for the subway, and I’m loving it. Very interesting and so simply written that a Southern-US-educated person like me can get every point.
I’ll let you know once I read “Everything…”.
the chaplain
October 23, 2009 at 10:27 pm
ildi:
Good point about the celibacy/married priest thing. If marriage is okay for the newbies, why not the oldies?
Phillychief:
You’re right about getting new members that have already been broken in. Even better, it often happens that the families moving over have been pretty active in their old churches, so when they migrate the new churches get ready-made lay leaders, young people to populate their youth groups, etc. Transfer growth is like winning the lottery.
Sarge:
Sometimes, the sheep get wise about one shepherd, but they still look at the shepherds in the other fields and think that they are different. Sometimes, sheep need to see lots of failed shepherds before they figure out the problem. Often, they never do figure it out.
Postie:
I started reading The Greatest Show… a couple of nights ago. It looks like it should be a fun read.
Mark
October 24, 2009 at 7:15 pm
They’re losing their flock and are desperate. The Evangelicals have been doing this for decades. They will witness to anyone outside of their particular brand of Christianity…to gain a soul and a few more bucks.
Sarge
October 25, 2009 at 8:01 am
That’s why dogs are used to keep them in line, “for their own good…”
Modusoperandi
October 25, 2009 at 1:22 pm
It sounds to me like they’re trying to catch the “low hanging Protestants”. Anglicans, with the pseudo-Catholic hierarchy, are Catholic enough to not be “real” Protestants, but too Protestant, since their head isn’t the Pope, to be “real” Catholics, (and vice versa) if memory serves. Lastly, I really enjoy commas. They’re like a coffee break for sentences.
the chaplain “Has anyone discovered a gene for the ‘My actions are not immoral, but yours are, even though we’re doing the same thing’ trait?”
Yes. It’s the same one that gives us thumbs. I’m willing to put up with hypocrisy if it means being able to wear mittens and not having the mitten-thumb just dangle there.
cl “Gee, what an intelligent, rational, (not to mention original) statement! I’m so impressed by the ‘commitment’ to reason you brag about at your ‘bitch spot!’”
It’s a valid point. Have they changed their system to ensure that what happened before isn’t happening now, or is oversight doing the same things it did before (ignore, deny, move the perpetrator, cover-up, move the perpetrator, blame the victim…and when those eventually fail, pay up and move the perp to the Vatican)? In short, is the Vatican protecting the sheep or the Church?
cl
October 27, 2009 at 6:35 pm
Modus,
The issues you raised are valid points. Cephus’ comment I mocked was not.
Will
October 31, 2009 at 4:22 pm
I know it’s easy to judge and imediately label the catholics because of this recent news story. As a member of the Episcopa Church I am actually glad to see the news. The word catholic, which often appears in Protestant books of prayer and hymnals means universal. Any of us who are honest and know some history know that Protestants were not around at the time of Jesus. “The Church” for all intents and purposes was the Catholic Church until the time of the Reformation. The Pope’s desire to welcome ALL is not in my opinion trying to fill pews or see offerings rise. he is being authentic to his calling as the head shepherd of his people. Catholics take an awful lot of criticism for some of the things like the pedophilia scandals. This is not unique ot their church. But seeing that takes honesty and integrity. Easy to blame everyone but our own denomination or religion for the world’s problems. Easy to call everyone else a hypocrite. The Pope is trying to be welcoming to those who are disenfranchised and seek a church community similar to the one they have known, but no feel uncomfortable in. I would cut him a little slack and assume the best. I for one am glad to see the open minded stance. I have not always seen that in churches I have attended.
PhillyChief
October 31, 2009 at 4:55 pm
Would you still assume the best if it were the head of NAMBLA reaching out to other groups? Perhaps he too would merely be authentic to his calling and his only desire would be to welcome ALL and not to fill memberships or see dues increase either. Is faithfully following one’s calling the only issue of worth here, Will? Was that really your only consideration? As a self proclaimed honest man Will, I’d like to hear your response.